Dr. Kortni (00:00)
Welcome to the Compassionate Newsroom, your gateway to transforming the heart and soul of journalism. I'm your host, Dr. Kortni Alston Lemon. I'm a former news director and television reporter turned happiness scholar. Now I train news leaders and journalists worldwide, teaching them how to cultivate workplace wellbeing and resilience with positive psychology. Each week, join me as I share evidence-based strategies.
and talk with some of the most inspiring people in the industry, including news leaders, journalists, trainers, and mental health experts. Together we'll share actionable approaches to help you. Imagine a newsroom that not only cares about the story, but profoundly values the people behind them. A place where compassion is the competitive advantage. Don't just listen, become part of this transformative journey. Subscribe to and share The Compassionate Newsroom. Let's champion a more supportive,
healthier and happier newsroom culture, one episode at a time.
Dr. Kortni Alston Lemon (01:02)
Happy New Year and welcome to another Wellbeing Wednesday. I'm Dr. Kortni and you're listening to episode 10 of the Compassionate Newsroom podcast, the first episode of 2025. Today we're joined by Kristen Hare, the director of craft and local news at Poynter. Kristen teaches journalists the essential skills needed to effectively cover and serve their communities.
She also writes a weekly newsletter, Local Edition, which is focused on local news. In this episode, discusses her concept of work-life chemistry. had a chance to experience his workshop at the Carter Center. It is incredible. Kristen will share her formula from the work-life chemistry course, which is available online at Poynter. For more details, check out our show notes, or you can visit our website.
at thecompassionatenewsroom.com forward slash the number 10. That's thecompassionatenewsroom.com forward slash 10. Now let's get started.
Dr. Kortni (02:01)
So excited about this conversation. Kristen, your name came up and your incredible course at Poynter, came up in like one of the first episodes of this podcast with Kerwin Speight of course, your colleague over at the Poynter Institute.
Kristen Hare (02:17)
Yeah.
Dr. Kortni (02:19)
And so I am so excited that you're here. Thank you so much for being here.
Kristen Hare (02:23)
Thanks for inviting me. I'm excited to talk to you today.
Dr. Kortni (02:26)
thank you. Thank you. So this is one of things that I am really excited about as it relates to the podcast is being able to provide resources for news organizations. And your workshop is incredible. And we're going to dive into that in a moment. But I wanted to also find out more about your journey as it relates to journalism, because you have an incredible background working as a reporter.
Kristen Hare (02:43)
Yeah.
Dr. Kortni (02:56)
What inspirational leader have you come across throughout your tenure in journalism? And why were they that inspirational to you?
Kristen Hare (03:09)
think every boss that I've had has shown me something that I needed to learn about how to have a life and a career at the same time. so the first was my very first editor, Jess Dehaven at the St. Joseph, Missouri News Press. She was a features editor. And we found ourselves through no kind of planning pregnant at the same time, a couple of months apart. I was a little bit ahead of her.
working for somebody and, you know, I was in my late twenties who would come up to me and say, hey, all your stuff is turned in, your deadlines are done and you're kind of green, go home. You know, just that she saw me as a person and she was going through the same thing at the same time was really powerful. She is still a friend and our kids are about the same age. And then at my next newsroom, the St. Louis Beacon, I worked for
a number of really remarkable women. One of them was Margaret Wolf Freivogel, and she was one of the founding editors. she and her husband had job shared at Washington, D.C. Bureau job when they were younger, as they were starting their family. And this was, you know, decades before I came along. And so, you know, from her, I learned
partnership and what it looks like to still really be succeeding and hitting the marks that I think society tells us that we have to hit. And having an amazing family and partner. And then the last one that I'll mention is when I came to Poynter, my editor at the time was Andrew Beaujon And he's a really hardworking and talented journalist and editor.
And he made this impression on me really before I even accepted the job. I had been working part-time and remote up until then since I having my eldest. And I said, okay, well, I'd like to work 30 hours for you for this position to cover the news for Poynter. And he said, I'm going to advocate that you work 40 because I know you're going to work it anyway. And I'd like to pay you for that. And so just to be again, like,
seen and valued and to have those quiet parts said out loud by someone who I hadn't even yet worked for. And I mean, we worked really hard, but I always felt like there was space to also be a full person. And so those are three of the leaders that I have gotten to work with throughout my career. And I've had many more since, who just made me, I think showed me that
There are lots of ways to do things and they can include seeing each other as human beings and not just as journalists.
Dr. Kortni (05:49)
that is really powerful, right? Seeing each other in work as it relates to really who we are opposed to simply what we do. I love that you shared that and all the incredible leaders that you've had in your journey says so much. I know you originally started off, as you just mentioned, at Poynter at reporting.
Kristen Hare (05:51)
Mmm.
Right.
Yeah.
Dr. Kortni (06:16)
and now making the transition over as faculty. So tell us about what drew you in to really creating this incredible workshop that I'm so fortunate to have been a part of when you came to the Carter Center. And I was like, she has to be on the podcast. She has to be on the podcast. And then I was like, my wish came true. She said, she said yes. But.
Kristen Hare (06:20)
Mm-hmm.
Right?
Dr. Kortni (06:41)
Tell us about how do you cultivate work-life chemistry? Because just hearing your journey through your leaders, it tells me a lot about your value system and kind of what brought you there. So I'm so curious in terms of how that cultivated.
Kristen Hare (06:49)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
So I'm gonna go back even farther and tell you that the place that this seed that ended up becoming, you know, the lovely tree that has work-life chemistry was first planted in me was in the Peace Corps. So after I graduated from journalism school at the University of Missouri, I'm a native Missourian, I joined the Peace Corps. And my thought at the time was if I'm gonna spend the rest of my life telling other people's stories, I wanna have some adventures of my own.
which sounded great, but also was really naive because I'm 46 and I'm still having adventures, you know, with other people's stories with my own. But when I was, you know, in my early 20s and graduating from college, that felt like a cool thing to do. So I ended up in Guyana in South America and had a really transformative two and a half years. I met my husband there. He's Guyanese, he's from Guyana. So Guyana is still really a big part of my life. We go back often, his family comes often to see us.
And the thing that happened for me there that was, I think, was the beginning of this was I went from the hustle culture of the United States and especially early in your journalism career, regardless of what you're doing, this sense of you never can do enough, you never can work enough, you never can hustle enough, you never can push enough. And there's always somebody who's better than you and don't even sleep.
like constant drum beat, I went completely silent because I was a high school teacher and I was doing something really different. you know, in Guyana, like a lot of places in the West Indies and the Caribbean in particular, the metabolism is just a lot slower. People move slower. It's really hot, you know. Everything...
were in the village where I lived, which was on the Esso-Quibaut coast and that region too, was just less convenient. I couldn't jump in a car and get where I needed to go. I had to wait for a minibus or a taxi driver. you know, if it was pouring monsoon rains, you couldn't really leave your house until it stopped. so you just slowed down because you had to. The world insisted. And in fact, if I would be in the capital, you know, walking from one place to another,
you know, people I would pass would literally slow down. They would shout at me, please, why are you walking so fast? Slow down. And so over the course of two years, I did. Yes. And so I came back to the US and I had that feeling that you get, know, when you step off the people mover at the airport and, and I was just like, I was so jarred. Or maybe when you step on, like, my gosh, everybody was moving so fast and everything was, you know, and I had
Dr. Kortni (09:14)
Wow!
Kristen Hare (09:35)
really cultivated this time and space for myself, for building community, for relationships and for my work. And it all felt really meaningful. And so I went from that to my husband and I went to, you know, Missouri winters and being in the dark from the time you get up to the time you get home from work and, you know, starting a family. And I had this dissatisfaction by the time I got to Poynter. I had had 10 years in my career.
and 10 years as a reporter, two kids, Max and Leela, who are now 17 and 14. And I had this dissatisfaction with really everything for me as a writer starts with language. I was really dissatisfied with the term work-life balance because, you know, I thought maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I'm working more than I'm life-ing. I am never going to be able to get those two things to balance out. And frankly, I love my work.
I'm proud of the work that I do. I don't want to feel guilty because it's not the same as everything that does not work. And so I started, it started really just as almost a word problem that I wanted to find. There has to be a better way to think about this and a saner way to understand how the pieces of my life fit together in a way that is satisfying and inspiring for me and that doesn't instantly lead to guilt.
And so this is where chemistry came from. And I started playing with the idea and really the format that I use today to help people figure out their own work life chemistry is the same format I use myself, is really, you're just thinking about the things you've said yes and no to in your life and letting that guide you and to figuring out what matters to you.
Dr. Kortni (11:20)
I love that. I really do because it can be challenging when we start to think about, how you, you urge us to reevaluate balance and, and, and then opposed to the work life balance, it's the work life chemistry. So, so what is work life chemistry?
Kristen Hare (11:43)
So work-life chemistry is how the pieces of your life, which include your work and your family, the things you love to do, how they all fit together to hopefully result in a formula that equals you bubbling all of the time and doing well. Of course, that's not reality. Most of us get burned out. We stumble. have hills and valleys. But when you understand what drives you,
it can help you make informed decisions instead of being driven by what everyone else or culture or our families or, you know, the world is telling us we should be going toward. like, for instance, I understood by looking back at my choices throughout my early career, that one of the things that was really important to me was flexibility. And I was saying yes to jobs that let me, you know, after I had children work from home, but
I also did the Peace Corps when I was able to do that because I wanted to be flexible enough to be able to say yes to that opportunity. so flexibility has always been key for me. Another is creativity. know, can I, what can I do with this that is interesting to me, that gets me excited, that gets me inspired? And so once you understand what's important to you, then you can use that formula to help you make decisions. So when I left,
the editorial team where I'd been for seven years and joined the teaching team at Poynter. One of the reasons I was able to say yes to that was because post 2020, we were teaching really differently than we had been up to that point. Before then, I think our faculty had been more kind of road warriors. They were always on the road. They were always in hotels. They were traveling here and there. And we realized how powerful our teaching could be remotely.
if done well, if we apply the same principles that we have to our in-person teaching. And I happen to cover local news and local journalists and understand how much they need our training and how hard it is for them to take a week out of their lives and their work and convince their bosses to pay for it or God forbid, pay for it themselves. And so if we could deliver that work to them virtually in a flexible way, how exciting. And then for creativity, getting to
you know, put together training in a way that is meaningful for people and that breaks through whatever generation they're from, their background, their lived experiences and help them do their work better and feel better about it, was just, has always been super exciting. So Work Life Chemistry started as a 90 minute live session. It still is that. I deliver it virtually. That's the version that you got. And then I also have a six week.
newsletter that will come to you and you get to do work life chemistry in an asynchronous fashion. And it was really fun to get to think about how to deliver that message in a different way.
Dr. Kortni (14:30)
I love that because one of things I really value about the fact that you have all of these different elements in terms of the whole in-person and then virtual and then making it really a popular email course like right at Poynter. Were there any challenges that you faced in like translating some of those incredible sessions?
Kristen Hare (14:49)
Right.
Dr. Kortni (14:57)
because one of the things that I really valued from the virtual session was the breakout. And I know that that in itself, it was a challenge. would imagine a challenge because we only gave you like 60 minutes, right?
Kristen Hare (14:58)
So many.
Yeah.
my gosh, yeah.
Let me tell you that the first challenge, and ultimately what this gets down to is, it always gets down to storytelling. And how do, okay, so I can't tell the story in this way. How do I tell, what is another way I can tell it so that it connects? So, and I tell this story in the virtual training, but the live training, maybe it's because I'm a features writer first, but I, you know, the lead matters, right? How you begin matters so much. And so I bring,
Dr. Kortni (15:37)
Yes.
Kristen Hare (15:40)
I asked for a volunteer and they come up to the front of the room and then they find themselves all of a sudden, they don't notice it when they're in the back of the room, but they find themselves standing on a disposable type of cloth. And they're usually like, no, what have I done? And then I give them a disposable poncho to put on. And everyone's laughing at this point. I give them little booties to cover their shoes and I give them plastic gloves. And after they're like, they look like they're sort of almost hazmat-ed out.
I ask them like, by the way, are you allergic to eggs? And everyone is like, wait, what? And then I pull out a carton of eggs. And I'm so visual in how I learn and how I share that what I tell them is, okay, this hand is work and this hand is life. And I'm gonna give you an egg for every element of both. And so we start with, okay, here's your partner, here's your kid, here's your dog, here's your vacations, here's your yoga, then here's your work, here's your boss, here's your team, here's your projects. And pretty soon,
they've got almost a dozen eggs in their hands and they're trying to balance them and not let them fall, but they can't put them together because we're holding our work and life separately like we do in work-life balance. And then I asked them to think about the last crisis that came at them in work or life, and that's the egg. I say, okay, you've got to catch it. And I throw it at them and their hands are full and they can't catch it and all the eggs go crashing down. So that is what happens when we hold our work and our life separate is we limit ourselves
You know, we sort of deny ourselves the ability to move quickly when stuff comes at us and it always comes at us. So that was the first thing going from teaching that live to teaching it virtually that I had to figure out how do I do this? And we tried lots of different methods. Ultimately, just telling that story, you can picture it. You understand what I'm saying. I think the point is driven home. And so that was one of many ways we had to figure out, OK, how do we do this in the newsletter?
And in the newsletter, really, I just tell and show you that. I show you pictures of people doing that activity. I ask people to think about what would you put in each hand? Think about how you, those things and how you hold them differently and the last crisis. I think the part that you're talking about that's really powerful in both live and in virtual is getting to sit and talk with a partner because...
I know personally, I think I know myself really well until I start talking to somebody who can read me very quickly. And as journalists, that is a skill that we have. We're very good at that. And what we ask people to do in the newsletter, we give them three options. One, forward this newsletter to somebody else and have them do this with you and set some time aside to talk about this, to work these things out. they have between each edition of the newsletter, they have a week before the next one comes.
So even something as simple as having a conversation with your roommate over dinner, know, here are the things I learned and then getting their reflections back because you do not have to be a journalist to be able to be insightful. The second option is to do this on your own and write it through. And the third option is to do both and to bring somebody in your life in and to write it through and to kind of talk it out yourself. did the first time I did this, I did it by myself. I wrote out, I was just positive that
family was going to be one of my key elements in my formula. And I wrote out my list of yeses and nos in my life and my career. And while my kids are incredibly important to me, I realized that actually the thing that popped out was flexibility. I was able to see that for myself. So I do think it's possible, but it is sure fun to get to talk to a lab partner.
Dr. Kortni (19:06)
I love how you have made all of these adjustments and the visual nature, right? I will admit, I felt kind of jealous. went, wow, I wasn't like in the space with her and I can't wear the hazmat suit because I would probably be the person up front. But I love that because it allows us to really see all that we carry, right?
Kristen Hare (19:21)
Yes.
Yeah,
just have to blow. Yeah, we just have to blow up the idea that those things deserve to be balanced. That makes no sense. And we're only setting ourselves up for failure if we try to do that.
Dr. Kortni (19:36)
Yes. Yes.
I love that and just the throwing of the eggs and understanding all, mean, all, cause it really, speaks to so much of so many different elements of our lives. It's really phenomenal. I am so, so curious about the impact because it clearly made an impact on me. The fact that literally immediately I reached out to you and wanted to connect and so grateful that we've connected.
Kristen Hare (19:44)
Hahaha
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you.
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kortni (20:06)
I'm curious about the impact on others in terms of other participants. What success stories have you gathered and learned from people in the past, right, that have really benefited from it?
Kristen Hare (20:22)
So I think the first and easiest answer is that everybody who learns this seems relieved to have a different framework than work-life balance. It is just a relief, right? Even if you don't ever do anything with it, even if all you say is, no, that's not a thing, because it's not, it's not a thing. And if it is a thing, it's a bad thing.
Dr. Kortni (20:35)
Wow.
Kristen Hare (20:47)
I think is the very top of what happens is it gives people some relief from an impossible concept. The thing that is always really exciting to me is hearing a year or two years later from people who've been through this training and how they have applied it. so I won't name names because I don't have their permission, but
One person who is an editor and was a top editor used her work life chemistry to help her make a decision about where she wanted to move next. And it wasn't the step up decision that I think she would have made previously. It was a step over that allowed her to be the kind of parent that she wanted to be. And in fact, is now a Capital B boss and use work life chemistry to help her with that. I can tell you my colleague, Kate Cox at Poynter
who leads our Women's Leadership Academy was in that workshop as a participant during a tough time in her career. And rather than running with her arms wildly swinging toward the next thing, think it was, Work-Life Chemistry was sort of a place for her to reevaluate what she wanted. And she ended up taking over Women's Leadership and joined Poynter's faculty this year in the fall.
One more story I will tell you is I think at the heart of this what I want people to know journalists in particular is this is not a nice to have because you know we're going to talk about health and wellness. This is a thing that when you have a healthy work life chemistry formula when you're thinking about your life in this way your work itself will be better because you will be better. And so I got an email
couple years ago from a person who had been through work life chemistry at a point of training and so had his boss and different trainings. And when they had a major crisis, breaking news situation in their town, they were able to stop and slow down enough to think about what they needed to do to protect their team, to make sure that everybody was
going to be okay coming out of this. they, told me they created a shift system that allowed people to cycle in and out and go get some rest before coming back and to take care of their families. And they did the best work they'd ever done because they were thinking about taking care of their people, not just about throwing everything they had at the story. They were coming at it really from a compassionate place and that made their work better.
Dr. Kortni (23:24)
Wow. I, you know, that in itself is really game changing. Right. And so, and that leads me to my next question, because I'm so curious about this and you led right into it. how can leaders begin to implement
Kristen Hare (23:29)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kortni (23:40)
Some of these strategies, cause I love what you just shared about what one team has done in regards to benefiting from the work life chemistry. I really value the whole idea of letting go of the balancing act, how refreshing it is for individuals for not feeling this level of exhaustion of
How do I balance it all? What does that even look like? So what does it look like for leaders to be able to implement more of the work-life formula?
Kristen Hare (24:05)
Mm-hmm.
I think it starts with being a human first. this is, think for a lot of us, a really natural thing in newsrooms, but I think there are a lot of people who feel like that is a no-no, but tell me about your kids, talk about your weekend, tell me about your dog, leave at 2 p.m. because you have a dentist appointment, tell people what you're doing.
Don't send emails at 3 a.m. in the morning. Take your vacations, don't check in, trust your people. Just the basics of whatever you do as a leader, you're sending a message. And whether you're saying that message or showing that message, the people who work for you will get it. So when this summer, my boss went on a vacation for two weeks and we didn't hear a peep from her.
That's the most liberating thing that a manager can do is take your vacation and trust your people while you're gone. And then come back refreshed and like lead by example, show what that looks like. Of course, managers have to work late nights, there are crisis, there are meetings, know, that all exists. But we like to say at Poynter that, you know, stress flows downhill and whatever it is that you're feeling, your people are gonna pick up on it. And if you can,
show what it looks like to be a full human, which I mean, we can't deny that we are, who has things they have to do and kids to get to practices and animals that need to go to the vet and plumbers that have to be met between one and four, all of those things are real things we all have to deal with. so I think not pretending like that doesn't exist, talking about your life and in and out of work.
is it just gives everybody else permission to also be fully human in their life and in their work. And the benefit is it makes us better journalists.
Dr. Kortni (26:15)
It really does. I value what you just shared in regards to just hearing about your supervisor, right? Taking two weeks and really taking two weeks. And I say that because it sounds, yeah, but no. Reality, sometimes things come up and they happen, but...
Kristen Hare (26:25)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Dr. Kortni (26:37)
That is leading with in terms of not only a powerful example, but really modeling behavior for empowerment within that space. So how can leaders, because one of the things I feel is.
Kristen Hare (26:45)
Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Kortni (26:54)
It starts with you, right? So how can they start showing up for themselves and practicing levels of the work life chemistry so they can be just like yourself and your supervisor in terms of being able to model that behavior?
Kristen Hare (27:11)
think it starts by figuring out what drives you, what is exciting to you, what is it that you enjoy, and we're all driven by different things. And so you can obviously take the course through our newsletter, but you can also just write down a list of what you said yes and no to throughout your life and your career and see what does that list tell you? What do your choices reveal?
about what is important to you. will probably be surprising. And I'm, you know, there's no trade secret here. Work-life chemistry is pretty simple. And it is just discovering what it is actually that pushes you forward, that makes you do your best work. And once you figure that out, then, you know, if it is like me, creativity,
Do you have enough of that in your work and your life? Do you need to find some projects that allow you to flex those muscles? Do you need to work on something outside of your work that allows you to feel that? I also write books about things to do in Tampa Bay, and that is a huge creative pursuit for me that I really enjoy. I'm able to be flexible when I do that, and it's a really fun way to build community. So whatever it is that your formula is telling you is important to you, then finding ways to make
time for that. if it is community, making sure that you find a church or a singing group or, you know, something outside of the newsroom that is fulfilling that helps you build community because we need that outside of the newsroom as well as within. If it is to have, you know, integrity, running what you're doing through the filter of is, is this helping me live up to the integrity that I want to have, you know, while I'm doing they're just really nice.
For me, my work-life chemistry formula is just a set of sort of directions that I wanna keep moving in. And as long as most of the things in my life are aligning with those directions, I tend to be doing pretty good.
Dr. Kortni (29:06)
I love that. I'm curious, what's the future direction when it comes down to the work-life chemistry workshop? Is there anything that might be coming up on horizon with Poynter?
Kristen Hare (29:16)
Yeah,
that's a great question. We are thinking right now about the experience that people have when they come through Poynter at different points in their career. And right now we have kind of a one size fits all for work life chemistry, and I teach it to lots of different groups. I have run fellowships for early career journalists. We do lots of things with leaders and people really need different things at different points in their career.
whether you're a new manager, a mid-career, an executive, someone just starting in your career, someone who's no longer in your career but still cares a lot about the industry. And so what I'm trying to do next is figure out what does this look like depending on where you're at in your career. And for the people at the top, is there a way for them to learn this and then to teach it in their own newsrooms? So rather than me doing all of the teaching, can I train some trainers?
to help people think in their own newsrooms about their work-life chemistry.
Dr. Kortni (30:12)
That is so fantastic because that is so important in regards to really empowering leaders. But then it goes back to what you shared earlier, is creating this culture of care, right? Of thinking about compassion and being human throughout it all, right? I love this. So I hate this part.
Kristen Hare (30:13)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Right. Right.
Dr. Kortni (30:34)
because it's, it's, the end, but, but I, I love this because I feel like this is also just the beginning. Kristen And I really would love to see you come back, especially after you start implementing some more of these different elements of, checking in with different teams, you are incredible. And the work that you're doing is so impactful. And, and as you were sharing, go, wow.
Kristen Hare (30:43)
I'd love to.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Dr. Kortni (30:59)
I can, I get every reason and understanding of my being why I'm so drawn to you and your work. Part of it is because it mirrors a lot of my work in my PhD program of meaningful work and the map of meaning, it's a theory that I utilize throughout the program talking about community and a sense of belonging.
Kristen Hare (31:11)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Dr. Kortni (31:22)
And the work that you're doing is, is, so life changing. And I'm so grateful that I had a chance to take part in it through your incredible workshop at the Carter Center. So, my last question to you is a question I ask everyone. And I am doing this because I want to be able to see what we
Kristen Hare (31:26)
Thank you.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kortni (31:48)
are saying to each other and what we believe in terms of what compassionate leadership looks like, especially in the industry that we all love, right? So what is compassionate leadership to you?
Kristen Hare (31:56)
Mm. Right.
What it means to me is meeting people where they are and taking a really, as much as you can, a customized approach to leading the people you have, the team that you have for the place where you are, for the communities that you're serving and understanding that we do not live in a one-size-fits-all media world. We haven't for a long time. That includes
You know, if you are of a different generation than the people who work for you, understanding how do they communicate? What is important to them? If you end a text to them in a period, are they gonna think they're all getting fired? Like different generations read things differently and compassionate and caring leaders take the time to understand what that feels like depending on your age, your lived experience, your background, your race, your religion.
you know, the things that you care about. Being fluent in what matters to the people in your shop is really important. And it's not that hard. After all, we're journalists. All we have to do is ask. It's literally the easiest thing in the world. So seeing people as individuals and treating them that way as managers and as colleagues, I think is the key for me.
Dr. Kortni (33:17)
Well, thank you so much for all your incredible work that you're doing pouring into all of us in the industry. I truly appreciate you, Kristen. Thank you so much for being here today.
Dr. Kortni (33:30)
for tuning into the Compassionate Newsroom podcast. Together we can transform workplace wellbeing in news. If you found value in today's episode, please share it with a colleague to help foster a supportive environment in the industry. And don't forget to subscribe and also visit our website for more resources at thecompassionatenewsroom.com.
